Discussion:
[lopsa-tech] Good Linux VPS to host personal domain with IMAPS?
(too old to reply)
John Stoffel
2016-07-06 02:14:29 UTC
Permalink
Guys,
I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.

I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.

I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
possibly others.

Thanks,
John
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https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
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Derek J. Balling
2016-07-06 02:47:09 UTC
Permalink
Linode is awesome. Been there for years and wouldn't switch away for
anything in the world.

And I get to have my servers outside the US borders, which is a nice perk.

D


On 7/5/2016 10:14 PM, John Stoffel wrote:
> Guys,
> I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
> want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
> personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
>
> I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
> place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
> want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
> from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.
>
> I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
> possibly others.
>
> Thanks,
> John
> _______________________________________________
> Tech mailing list
> ***@lists.lopsa.org
> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
> http://lopsa.org/

--
I prefer to use encrypted mail. My public key fingerprint is
FD6A 6990 F035 DE9E 3713 B4F1 661B 3AD6 D82A BBD0.

You can download it at http://www.megacity.org/gpg_dballing.txt

Learn how to encrypt your email with the E-Mail Self Defense
Guide: https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org/en/
Brad Beyenhof
2016-07-06 02:58:32 UTC
Permalink
Kindle is good, but pricey. Digital Ocean looks cool, but I haven't played around with it enough yet to have a solid opinion.

I have a cheap VPS from hostigation.com for $40/year (OpenVZ, but they also have KVM plans for a little more). LowEndBox.com has some good hosting reviews/comparisons if you just need to find something small.

--
Brad Beyenhof . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . http://augmentedfourth.com
Every man takes the limits of his own field of vision for the limits
of the world.
~ Arthur Schopenhauer, German philosopher (1788-1860)


> On Jul 5, 2016, at 7:47 PM, Derek J. Balling <***@megacity.org> wrote:
>
> Linode is awesome. Been there for years and wouldn't switch away for
> anything in the world.
>
> And I get to have my servers outside the US borders, which is a nice perk.
>
> D
>
>
>> On 7/5/2016 10:14 PM, John Stoffel wrote:
>> Guys,
>> I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
>> want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
>> personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
>>
>> I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
>> place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
>> want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
>> from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.
>>
>> I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
>> possibly others.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> John
>> _______________________________________________
>> Tech mailing list
>> ***@lists.lopsa.org
>> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
>> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
>> http://lopsa.org/
>
> --
> I prefer to use encrypted mail. My public key fingerprint is
> FD6A 6990 F035 DE9E 3713 B4F1 661B 3AD6 D82A BBD0.
>
> You can download it at http://www.megacity.org/gpg_dballing.txt
>
> Learn how to encrypt your email with the E-Mail Self Defense
> Guide: https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org/en/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tech mailing list
> ***@lists.lopsa.org
> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
> http://lopsa.org/
Brad Beyenhof
2016-07-06 03:49:58 UTC
Permalink
s/Kindle/Linode/

Sorry; was mobile.

--
Brad Beyenhof . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . http://augmentedfourth.com
Every man takes the limits of his own field of vision for the limits
of the world.
~ Arthur Schopenhauer, German philosopher (1788-1860)


> On Jul 5, 2016, at 7:58 PM, Brad Beyenhof <***@icloud.com> wrote:
>
> Kindle is good, but pricey. Digital Ocean looks cool, but I haven't played around with it enough yet to have a solid opinion.
>
> I have a cheap VPS from hostigation.com for $40/year (OpenVZ, but they also have KVM plans for a little more). LowEndBox.com has some good hosting reviews/comparisons if you just need to find something small.
>
> --
> Brad Beyenhof . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . http://augmentedfourth.com
> Every man takes the limits of his own field of vision for the limits
> of the world.
> ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, German philosopher (1788-1860)
>
>
>> On Jul 5, 2016, at 7:47 PM, Derek J. Balling <***@megacity.org> wrote:
>>
>> Linode is awesome. Been there for years and wouldn't switch away for
>> anything in the world.
>>
>> And I get to have my servers outside the US borders, which is a nice perk.
>>
>> D
>>
>>
>>> On 7/5/2016 10:14 PM, John Stoffel wrote:
>>> Guys,
>>> I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
>>> want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
>>> personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
>>>
>>> I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
>>> place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
>>> want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
>>> from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.
>>>
>>> I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
>>> possibly others.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> John
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Tech mailing list
>>> ***@lists.lopsa.org
>>> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
>>> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
>>> http://lopsa.org/
>>
>> --
>> I prefer to use encrypted mail. My public key fingerprint is
>> FD6A 6990 F035 DE9E 3713 B4F1 661B 3AD6 D82A BBD0.
>>
>> You can download it at http://www.megacity.org/gpg_dballing.txt
>>
>> Learn how to encrypt your email with the E-Mail Self Defense
>> Guide: https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org/en/
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Tech mailing list
>> ***@lists.lopsa.org
>> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
>> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
>> http://lopsa.org/
> _______________________________________________
> Tech mailing list
> ***@lists.lopsa.org
> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
> http://lopsa.org/
David Veer
2016-07-06 03:00:55 UTC
Permalink
I have had good experiences with DigitalOcean, my next project will be on there. Although it’s not as feature rich as other providers, it has a simple and elegant interface and droplet (VPS instance) spin-ups are really fast. Their basic package starts at $5/month but have options scaling up as powerful as you need

-David

—
David J. Veer
***@me.com

> On Jul 5, 2016, at 9:47 PM, Derek J. Balling <***@megacity.org> wrote:
>
> Linode is awesome. Been there for years and wouldn't switch away for
> anything in the world.
>
> And I get to have my servers outside the US borders, which is a nice perk.
>
> D
>
>
> On 7/5/2016 10:14 PM, John Stoffel wrote:
>> Guys,
>> I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
>> want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
>> personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
>>
>> I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
>> place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
>> want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
>> from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.
>>
>> I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
>> possibly others.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> John
>> _______________________________________________
>> Tech mailing list
>> ***@lists.lopsa.org
>> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
>> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
>> http://lopsa.org/
>
> --
> I prefer to use encrypted mail. My public key fingerprint is
> FD6A 6990 F035 DE9E 3713 B4F1 661B 3AD6 D82A BBD0.
>
> You can download it at http://www.megacity.org/gpg_dballing.txt
>
> Learn how to encrypt your email with the E-Mail Self Defense
> Guide: https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org/en/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tech mailing list
> ***@lists.lopsa.org
> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
> http://lopsa.org/
Conrad Wood
2016-07-06 11:36:46 UTC
Permalink
I can highly recommend bitfolk.
Small company, the owner is very much on top of every issue that arises
and responds actively to concerns that arise on their mailing list.
Good connectivity, good price, nice people.

I do not work for bitfolk or get financial incentives but I host a
couple of VMs there for almost a decade and never had a reason to
consider switching to a different provider.

Conrad

On Tue, 2016-07-05 at 22:00 -0500, David Veer wrote:
> I have had good experiences with DigitalOcean, my next project will be
> on there. Although it’s not as feature rich as other providers, it
> has a simple and elegant interface and droplet (VPS instance) spin-ups
> are really fast. Their basic package starts at $5/month but have
> options scaling up as powerful as you need
>
>
> -David
>
> —
> David J. Veer
> ***@me.com
>
> > On Jul 5, 2016, at 9:47 PM, Derek J. Balling <***@megacity.org>
> > wrote:
> >
> > Linode is awesome. Been there for years and wouldn't switch away for
> > anything in the world.
> >
> > And I get to have my servers outside the US borders, which is a nice
> > perk.
> >
> > D
> >
> >
> > On 7/5/2016 10:14 PM, John Stoffel wrote:
> > > Guys,
> > > I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and
> > > they
> > > want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
> > > personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
> > >
> > > I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or
> > > some
> > > place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I
> > > really
> > > want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well
> > > as
> > > from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.
> > >
> > > I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
> > > possibly others.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > John
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Tech mailing list
> > > ***@lists.lopsa.org
> > > https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
> > > This list provided by the League of Professional System
> > > Administrators
> > > http://lopsa.org/
> >
> > --
> > I prefer to use encrypted mail. My public key fingerprint is
> > FD6A 6990 F035 DE9E 3713 B4F1 661B 3AD6 D82A BBD0.
> >
> > You can download it at http://www.megacity.org/gpg_dballing.txt
> >
> > Learn how to encrypt your email with the E-Mail Self Defense
> > Guide: https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org/en/
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Tech mailing list
> > ***@lists.lopsa.org
> > https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
> > This list provided by the League of Professional System
> > Administrators
> > http://lopsa.org/
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tech mailing list
> ***@lists.lopsa.org
> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
> http://lopsa.org/
Steve Potter
2016-07-06 02:59:58 UTC
Permalink
Prgmr.com is run by a LOPSA member, gives discounts to LOPSA members, and they've been excellent to me for the past 5 or 6 years. 
-spp

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: John Stoffel <***@stoffel.org> Date: 7/5/16 10:14 PM (GMT-05:00) To: ***@lists.lopsa.org Subject: [lopsa-tech] Good Linux VPS to host personal domain with IMAPS?

Guys,
I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.

I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.

I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
possibly others.

Thanks,
John
_______________________________________________
Tech mailing list
***@lists.lopsa.org
https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
http://lopsa.org/
Ryan Finnesey
2016-07-06 03:38:05 UTC
Permalink
Is there a formal process if I would like to give discounts to LOPSA members?

From: tech-***@lists.lopsa.org [mailto:tech-***@lists.lopsa.org] On Behalf Of Steve Potter
Sent: Tuesday, July 5, 2016 11:00 PM
To: John Stoffel <***@stoffel.org>; ***@lists.lopsa.org
Subject: Re: [lopsa-tech] Good Linux VPS to host personal domain with IMAPS?


Prgmr.com is run by a LOPSA member, gives discounts to LOPSA members, and they've been excellent to me for the past 5 or 6 years.

-spp


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: John Stoffel <***@stoffel.org<mailto:***@stoffel.org>>
Date: 7/5/16 10:14 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: ***@lists.lopsa.org<mailto:***@lists.lopsa.org>
Subject: [lopsa-tech] Good Linux VPS to host personal domain with IMAPS?


Guys,
I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.

I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.

I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
possibly others.

Thanks,
John
_______________________________________________
Tech mailing list
***@lists.lopsa.org<mailto:***@lists.lopsa.org>
https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
http://lopsa.org/
Ryan Finnesey
2016-07-06 11:31:25 UTC
Permalink
Thanks I will do that. I was thinking of putting together an offer where member get a free month of Office 365 or a discount off the monthly subscription. I can offer this both to new and current Office 365 customers. I don’t know if offers like this are helpful to the community.



From: Aleksey Tsalolikhin [mailto:***@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 6, 2016 1:01 AM
To: Ryan Finnesey <***@finnesey.com>
Cc: John Stoffel <***@stoffel.org>; ***@lists.lopsa.org
Subject: Re: [lopsa-tech] Good Linux VPS to host personal domain with IMAPS?

https://lopsa.org/Partner-Vendors quoths:

Interested in providing a member discount? Send mail to us (***@lopsa.org<mailto:***@lopsa.org>) and let us know.

Best,
Aleksey

On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 8:38 PM, Ryan Finnesey <***@finnesey.com<mailto:***@finnesey.com>> wrote:
Is there a formal process if I would like to give discounts to LOPSA members?

From: tech-***@lists.lopsa.org<mailto:tech-***@lists.lopsa.org> [mailto:tech-***@lists.lopsa.org<mailto:tech-***@lists.lopsa.org>] On Behalf Of Steve Potter
Sent: Tuesday, July 5, 2016 11:00 PM
To: John Stoffel <***@stoffel.org<mailto:***@stoffel.org>>; ***@lists.lopsa.org<mailto:***@lists.lopsa.org>
Subject: Re: [lopsa-tech] Good Linux VPS to host personal domain with IMAPS?


Prgmr.com is run by a LOPSA member, gives discounts to LOPSA members, and they've been excellent to me for the past 5 or 6 years.

-spp


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: John Stoffel <***@stoffel.org<mailto:***@stoffel.org>>
Date: 7/5/16 10:14 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: ***@lists.lopsa.org<mailto:***@lists.lopsa.org>
Subject: [lopsa-tech] Good Linux VPS to host personal domain with IMAPS?


Guys,
I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
personal web site, but also my stoffel.org<http://stoffel.org> domain for mail.

I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.

I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com<http://prgmr.com> (looks good!) and
possibly others.

Thanks,
John
_______________________________________________
Tech mailing list
***@lists.lopsa.org<mailto:***@lists.lopsa.org>
https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
http://lopsa.org/

_______________________________________________
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***@lists.lopsa.org<mailto:***@lists.lopsa.org>
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This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
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--
Need CFEngine training? Email ***@verticalsysadmin.com<mailto:***@verticalsysadmin.com>
Alexander Lobodzinski
2016-07-06 09:27:37 UTC
Permalink
On 6.7.16 4:59, Steve Potter wrote:
> Prgmr.com is run by a LOPSA member, gives discounts to LOPSA members, and
> they've been excellent to me for the past 5 or 6 years.

The discount mentioned on lopsa.org/Member-Discounts offers less
resources at a higher price compared to prgmr.com's plain pricing page.
Some update missing I guess...

Ciao, Lobo
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Josh Smift
2016-07-06 10:02:42 UTC
Permalink
If really small will do, a t2.nano instance at AWS is $56/yr, or $38 if
you pay it up front. GCE's f1-micro seems to be similarly small.

(I use AWS both at work and for personal stuff; I haven't used GCE.)

-Josh (***@infersys.com)
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greyman
2016-07-06 03:45:27 UTC
Permalink
Also worth looking into;

ramnode.com

+1 for digital ocean
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Edward Ned Harvey (lopser)
2016-07-06 11:37:26 UTC
Permalink
> From: tech-***@lists.lopsa.org [mailto:tech-***@lists.lopsa.org]
> On Behalf Of John Stoffel
>
> hosting a static and pretty much dead
> personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
>
> I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
> place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really

If what you want to serve is some standard service - static http and imaps - then you're probably better off *not* getting a VPS, but instead getting a service. For example, you can use weebly, wix, or squarespace to host your website for free, and you can use various email providers (including gmail, and I'm guessing amazon) to host your imap email for free, or nominal charge.
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Adam Tauno Williams
2016-07-06 14:26:15 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 2016-07-05 at 22:14 -0400, John Stoffel wrote:
> I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
> want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
> personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
> I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
> place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
> want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
> from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.

I have been hosting my Cyrus IMAPd instance on a Linode for ages. I
couldn't be happier - they are great and performance is solid.

--
Adam Tauno Williams <mailto:***@whitemice.org> GPG D95ED383
OpenGroupware Developer <http://www.opengroupware.us/>


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Ted Cabeen
2016-07-06 16:17:22 UTC
Permalink
You've gotten lots of good answers. The only other one I'd want to
mention is that you can also host your personal email out of your home
server and use an AWS t2.nano instance to proxy the email in and out.
That eliminates storage charges for those of us with rather large email
archives. At $72 for a 3-year reserved AWS t2.nano instance, the cost
is super-low.

--Ted

On 2016-07-05 19:14, John Stoffel wrote:
>
> Guys,
> I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
> want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
> personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
>
> I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
> place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
> want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
> from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.
>
> I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
> possibly others.
>
> Thanks,
> John
> _______________________________________________
> Tech mailing list
> ***@lists.lopsa.org
> https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
> This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators
> http://lopsa.org/
>
_______________________________________________
Tech mailing list
***@lists.lopsa.org
https://lists.lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tech
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Ray Van Dolson
2016-07-06 16:22:36 UTC
Permalink
That's pretty clever.

A plug here for DigitalOcean. Has worked well (very low traffic
though) for me and I believe I'm paying like $5/mo.

Ray

On Wed, Jul 06, 2016 at 09:17:22AM -0700, Ted Cabeen wrote:
> You've gotten lots of good answers. The only other one I'd want to
> mention is that you can also host your personal email out of your
> home server and use an AWS t2.nano instance to proxy the email in
> and out. That eliminates storage charges for those of us with rather
> large email archives. At $72 for a 3-year reserved AWS t2.nano
> instance, the cost is super-low.
>
> --Ted
>
> On 2016-07-05 19:14, John Stoffel wrote:
> >
> >Guys,
> >I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
> >want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
> >personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
> >
> >I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
> >place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
> >want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
> >from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.
> >
> >I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
> >possibly others.
> >
> >Thanks,
> >John
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Matthew Butch
2016-07-06 17:09:41 UTC
Permalink
Another happy DO customer here. I especially like how their pricing starts at $5/month.

> On Jul 6, 2016, at 12:22, Ray Van Dolson <***@esri.com> wrote:
>
> That's pretty clever.
>
> A plug here for DigitalOcean. Has worked well (very low traffic
> though) for me and I believe I'm paying like $5/mo.
>
> Ray
>
> On Wed, Jul 06, 2016 at 09:17:22AM -0700, Ted Cabeen wrote:
>> You've gotten lots of good answers. The only other one I'd want to
>> mention is that you can also host your personal email out of your
>> home server and use an AWS t2.nano instance to proxy the email in
>> and out. That eliminates storage charges for those of us with rather
>> large email archives. At $72 for a 3-year reserved AWS t2.nano
>> instance, the cost is super-low.
>>
>> --Ted
>>
>> On 2016-07-05 19:14, John Stoffel wrote:
>>>
>>> Guys,
>>> I've just gotten a new bill from my current hosting provider and they
>>> want an arm and a leg for hosting a static and pretty much dead
>>> personal web site, but also my stoffel.org domain for mail.
>>>
>>> I'm looking for someplace to either do a VPS running Debian, or some
>>> place that has an IMAPS solution with Sieve filtering, since I really
>>> want to move to all IMAP so I can read email on my phone, as well as
>>> from within emacs using VM, or (probably more likely) using mutt.
>>>
>>> I've looked a little at DigitalOcean, prgmr.com (looks good!) and
>>> possibly others.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> John
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Yves Dorfsman
2016-07-06 17:53:07 UTC
Permalink
On 2016-07-06 10:17, Ted Cabeen wrote:
> You've gotten lots of good answers. The only other one I'd want to mention is
> that you can also host your personal email out of your home server and use an
> AWS t2.nano instance to proxy the email in and out. That eliminates storage
> charges for those of us with rather large email archives. At $72 for a 3-year
> reserved AWS t2.nano instance, the cost is super-low.

The issue with this, is that you no longer have access to email when your ISP
is down. This used not to be a problem, because no ISP meant no internet
anyway, but these days with internet access via your phone, and the usefulness
of email especially when there is an ISP outage, I think it is better to host
outside home.

I am myself hosting a few services at home, but am migrating all of it on
VPSes ro cloud services, using home for backup and playground:

- You can still access your consoles, reboot etc... on VPS/cloud even if away
from home, say on holiday or business trip

- no loss of access when your ISP is down

- although this depends, if your on old fashion cable, your down bandwidth is
much higher than you up bandwidth, so it make sense to backup from cloud to
home, rather then the other way around.

-storage at home vs cloud is much cheapre, so again it make sense to use home
to backup all your cloud services.

- cloud/VPS have redundant hardware and paid staff to take care of hardware
issues (typically the shoemaker's children saying apply to most sysadmin's
system!)


Also, and this is a bigger issue that I've been wanting to address in its own
thread: Do you have a sysadmin "buddy" who understands and have access to your
home system? If not, and you have dependants using your home system, have you
given any thought about how they will deal with an email outage when you are
in the hospital in critical condition, or just died?

--
http://yves.zioup.com
gpg: 4096R/32B0F416

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Derek Balling
2016-07-06 18:06:52 UTC
Permalink
>
> Also, and this is a bigger issue that I've been wanting to address in its
> own
> thread: Do you have a sysadmin "buddy" who understands and have access to
> your
> home system? If not, and you have dependants using your home system, have
> you
> given any thought about how they will deal with an email outage when you
> are
> in the hospital in critical condition, or just died?
>

I have a "break glass in case of fire" type envelope for my wife that I
update the contents of probably every 6-12 months. It has (among many other
things) all of that sort of info, and the name/phone/e-mail of folks who
can be given a set few passwords and who can then sort things out.

D
Josh Smift
2016-07-06 18:12:43 UTC
Permalink
DB> I have a "break glass in case of fire" type envelope for my wife that
DB> I update the contents of probably every 6-12 months. It has (among
DB> many other things) all of that sort of info, and the name/phone/e-mail
DB> of folks who can be given a set few passwords and who can then sort
DB> things out.

That seems like a good idea, and like something you'd want regardless of
whether your important data was in the cloud or on a 1990s-era tower in
your basement. :^)

(I agree with the "I don't want my data in my basement any more" sentiment
others have expressed; I made that move a long while ago, and never (well,
hardly ever) regretted it.)

-Josh (***@infersys.com)
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Adam Levin
2016-07-06 18:17:00 UTC
Permalink
My "break glass in case of fire" envelope contains the one password to my
password vault. All the rest of the stuff is up to date in there,
including information about home network devices and such.

-Adam

On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 2:12 PM, Josh Smift <***@infersys.com> wrote:

> DB> I have a "break glass in case of fire" type envelope for my wife that
> DB> I update the contents of probably every 6-12 months. It has (among
> DB> many other things) all of that sort of info, and the name/phone/e-mail
> DB> of folks who can be given a set few passwords and who can then sort
> DB> things out.
>
> That seems like a good idea, and like something you'd want regardless of
> whether your important data was in the cloud or on a 1990s-era tower in
> your basement. :^)
>
> (I agree with the "I don't want my data in my basement any more" sentiment
> others have expressed; I made that move a long while ago, and never (well,
> hardly ever) regretted it.)
>
> -Josh (***@infersys.com)
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Derek Balling
2016-07-06 18:18:45 UTC
Permalink
Heh, mine doesn't even have that (now that my password vault service has a
dead-man-switch type situation for survivors). It's mostly about things
like "here's the services we use, here's the logins you're looking for in
the vault", etc.

On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 2:17 PM, Adam Levin <***@gmail.com> wrote:

> My "break glass in case of fire" envelope contains the one password to my
> password vault. All the rest of the stuff is up to date in there,
> including information about home network devices and such.
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
Adam Levin
2016-07-06 18:56:09 UTC
Permalink
Step 1: For the love of everything holy, delete my browser history!

-Adam

On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 2:18 PM, Derek Balling <***@megacity.org> wrote:

> Heh, mine doesn't even have that (now that my password vault service has a
> dead-man-switch type situation for survivors). It's mostly about things
> like "here's the services we use, here's the logins you're looking for in
> the vault", etc.
>
> On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 2:17 PM, Adam Levin <***@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> My "break glass in case of fire" envelope contains the one password to my
>> password vault. All the rest of the stuff is up to date in there,
>> including information about home network devices and such.
>>
>> -Adam
>>
>>
>>
>
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>
Ted Cabeen
2016-07-06 21:28:20 UTC
Permalink
On 2016-07-06 10:53, Yves Dorfsman wrote:
> On 2016-07-06 10:17, Ted Cabeen wrote:
>> You've gotten lots of good answers. The only other one I'd want to mention is
>> that you can also host your personal email out of your home server and use an
>> AWS t2.nano instance to proxy the email in and out. That eliminates storage
>> charges for those of us with rather large email archives. At $72 for a 3-year
>> reserved AWS t2.nano instance, the cost is super-low.
>
> The issue with this, is that you no longer have access to email when your ISP
> is down. This used not to be a problem, because no ISP meant no internet
> anyway, but these days with internet access via your phone, and the usefulness
> of email especially when there is an ISP outage, I think it is better to host
> outside home.

Thankfully, my ISP is very reliable, and we don't have significant
outages that make this a problem. It happens from time to time, but
when it does, the problem is nearly always upstream, and resolves itself
within an hour or two. YMMV.

> I am myself hosting a few services at home, but am migrating all of it on
> VPSes ro cloud services, using home for backup and playground:

These are all good concerns, and each admin should decide whether and
how they apply to their unique situation. For me, personally, the
security of holding my own data is of value to me, as well as the
challenge that online cloud storage is quite expensive compared to local
storage.

> Also, and this is a bigger issue that I've been wanting to address in its own
> thread: Do you have a sysadmin "buddy" who understands and have access to your
> home system? If not, and you have dependants using your home system, have you
> given any thought about how they will deal with an email outage when you are
> in the hospital in critical condition, or just died?

Yes, I do have systems in place for if I die. Passwords are in a
password vault, and I do have a subset of those password stored in a
secure location, sufficient for my executor to access the vault or
migrate the services to an alternate provider, with the assistance of
admin friends. As I get older, I expect I'll simplify these setups
somewhat, but I'm happy with the tradeoffs I've selected right now.

If email happened to go down at the exact time I was in the hospital,
we'd just switch to other communications services during the crisis (IM,
SMS, Facebook messenger, etc.)

--Ted
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John Stoffel
2016-07-07 16:48:35 UTC
Permalink
Guys,

Thanks a ton for all the suggestions. I've looked into Linode and
Digital Ocean and some others. I'll probably end up at Digital Ocean
to start the process of setting up postfix/dovecot and spam
protection, and then move my mail domain over.

I also looked into google apps, and some other mail centric setups,
but I don't like them because of the cost/per-user and lack of
flexibility.

Doing this all myself, getting the SPF and DKIM records setup, and
making sure that my remote IMAPs clients can both send and receive
email from my domain is the important part for me.

I've got more comments to give in my further replies as I get some
time later on.

Thanks,
John
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Avdija Ahmedhodžić
2016-07-07 16:53:46 UTC
Permalink
You can always try zoho.com for affordable mail hosting

> On Jul 7, 2016, at 18:49, John Stoffel <***@stoffel.org> wrote:
>
>
> Guys,
>
> Thanks a ton for all the suggestions. I've looked into Linode and
> Digital Ocean and some others. I'll probably end up at Digital Ocean
> to start the process of setting up postfix/dovecot and spam
> protection, and then move my mail domain over.
>
> I also looked into google apps, and some other mail centric setups,
> but I don't like them because of the cost/per-user and lack of
> flexibility.
>
> Doing this all myself, getting the SPF and DKIM records setup, and
> making sure that my remote IMAPs clients can both send and receive
> email from my domain is the important part for me.
>
> I've got more comments to give in my further replies as I get some
> time later on.
>
> Thanks,
> John
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David Lang
2016-07-07 21:12:23 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 6 Jul 2016, Yves Dorfsman wrote:

> On 2016-07-06 10:17, Ted Cabeen wrote:
>> You've gotten lots of good answers. The only other one I'd want to mention is
>> that you can also host your personal email out of your home server and use an
>> AWS t2.nano instance to proxy the email in and out. That eliminates storage
>> charges for those of us with rather large email archives. At $72 for a 3-year
>> reserved AWS t2.nano instance, the cost is super-low.
>
> The issue with this, is that you no longer have access to email when your ISP
> is down. This used not to be a problem, because no ISP meant no internet
> anyway, but these days with internet access via your phone, and the usefulness
> of email especially when there is an ISP outage, I think it is better to host
> outside home.

I live in a place with not-so-good internet connectivity, and I think I would
have a horrible time dealing with all my mail from home over such a connection
(I currently have it all hosted at the house and ssh into the house when I'm
away to run pine, sometimes from my phone/tablet)

I've though about trying to setup the Cyrus replication features so that I would
have a copy both at home and hosted outside, with the two copies syncing
changes. Has anyone done anything along those lines?

David Lang
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John Stoffel
2016-07-08 01:22:58 UTC
Permalink
>>>>> "David" == David Lang <***@lang.hm> writes:

David> On Wed, 6 Jul 2016, Yves Dorfsman wrote:
>> On 2016-07-06 10:17, Ted Cabeen wrote:
>>> You've gotten lots of good answers. The only other one I'd want to mention is
>>> that you can also host your personal email out of your home server and use an
>>> AWS t2.nano instance to proxy the email in and out. That eliminates storage
>>> charges for those of us with rather large email archives. At $72 for a 3-year
>>> reserved AWS t2.nano instance, the cost is super-low.
>>
>> The issue with this, is that you no longer have access to email when your ISP
>> is down. This used not to be a problem, because no ISP meant no internet
>> anyway, but these days with internet access via your phone, and the usefulness
>> of email especially when there is an ISP outage, I think it is better to host
>> outside home.

David> I live in a place with not-so-good internet connectivity, and I
David> think I would have a horrible time dealing with all my mail
David> from home over such a connection (I currently have it all
David> hosted at the house and ssh into the house when I'm away to run
David> pine, sometimes from my phone/tablet)

Usually you have better down connectivity than up, so I would think
that hosting in the cloud would work pretty well. That's what I'm
doing now, which is setting up a digital ocean droplet.

The hard part is the migrating my domain and MX records away from the
current registrar who I've been with for the last 20 years. But since
the owner who was a friend sold the business, it's gone downhill.

David> I've though about trying to setup the Cyrus replication
David> features so that I would have a copy both at home and hosted
David> outside, with the two copies syncing changes. Has anyone done
David> anything along those lines?

I'm not sure I'd bother. But... have you looked at Dovecot instead of
Cyrus, and if so, which did you choose and why?

I really think I want IMAP so that I can read home email on my phone
more easily. Right now it's purely text based, which is awesome over
a simple SSH connection, but getting more and more difficult as more
and more images are sent in emails, and links to emails, etc.

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David Lang
2016-07-08 02:47:17 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 7 Jul 2016, John Stoffel wrote:

>>>>>> "David" == David Lang <***@lang.hm> writes:
>
> David> On Wed, 6 Jul 2016, Yves Dorfsman wrote:
>>> On 2016-07-06 10:17, Ted Cabeen wrote:
>>>> You've gotten lots of good answers. The only other one I'd want to mention is
>>>> that you can also host your personal email out of your home server and use an
>>>> AWS t2.nano instance to proxy the email in and out. That eliminates storage
>>>> charges for those of us with rather large email archives. At $72 for a 3-year
>>>> reserved AWS t2.nano instance, the cost is super-low.
>>>
>>> The issue with this, is that you no longer have access to email when your ISP
>>> is down. This used not to be a problem, because no ISP meant no internet
>>> anyway, but these days with internet access via your phone, and the usefulness
>>> of email especially when there is an ISP outage, I think it is better to host
>>> outside home.
>
> David> I live in a place with not-so-good internet connectivity, and I
> David> think I would have a horrible time dealing with all my mail
> David> from home over such a connection (I currently have it all
> David> hosted at the house and ssh into the house when I'm away to run
> David> pine, sometimes from my phone/tablet)
>
> Usually you have better down connectivity than up, so I would think
> that hosting in the cloud would work pretty well. That's what I'm
> doing now, which is setting up a digital ocean droplet.

'better down than up' can still result in too little down. Think four geeks with
3Mb down :-(

I still am subscribed to linux-kernel amoung other things. dealing with 1k+
messages/day locally with cyrus/pine is no big deal. Doing the same thing over a
congested link, competing with browsing/streaming/etc is not a nice thing.

At work they went from a local exchange server to office365 and there was a
significant degredation in service for dealing with large amounts of mail.

> David> I've though about trying to setup the Cyrus replication
> David> features so that I would have a copy both at home and hosted
> David> outside, with the two copies syncing changes. Has anyone done
> David> anything along those lines?
>
> I'm not sure I'd bother. But... have you looked at Dovecot instead of
> Cyrus, and if so, which did you choose and why?

I started with Cyrus. How would Dovecot be any better? Does it have back-end
replication/clustering/failover like Cyrus does? or some other feature that
would let me replicate/split my mail repository?

I routinely have high tens of thousands, to low hundreds of thousands of mail in
a single folder, cyrus handles that well (even without a SSD), how would Dovecot
handle that?

> I really think I want IMAP so that I can read home email on my phone
> more easily. Right now it's purely text based, which is awesome over
> a simple SSH connection, but getting more and more difficult as more
> and more images are sent in emails, and links to emails, etc.

I absolutly require IMAP so that I can access the same mail from multiple
devices and keep it stored on the server.

I haven't found an android imap client I'm happy with yet, let alone anything
that would be sane to point at my mail volume

David Lang
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WK
2016-07-08 21:23:06 UTC
Permalink
On 7/7/2016 7:47 PM, David Lang wrote:
> I started with Cyrus. How would Dovecot be any better? Does it have
> back-end replication/clustering/failover like Cyrus does? or some
> other feature that would let me replicate/split my mail repository?
>
> I routinely have high tens of thousands, to low hundreds of thousands
> of mail in a single folder, cyrus handles that well (even without a
> SSD), how would Dovecot handle that?


Dovecot has their dsync tool (kind of like rsync for Maildirs).

It works extremely well.

We have a several clients at $dayjob who maintain their IMAP servers in
VMs/HW Servers here and then dsync down to a dovecot/postfix box at
their office. That way, they always have a local copy for when they are
at their office. It cuts down on the junk traffic out the gateway when
you have a limited office internet connection shared by a bunch of
employees.

They also rate limit outbound SMTP from the office mailserver's outbound
queue. The employees can dump email into the queue at line speed, but
the outgoing SMTP doesn't suck all the BW out of the connection when its
a bunch of huge files.

Then of course for mobile and their home, they just point their imap
client at the public VM.

Again works really well and the only issue is which logs you need to
look at when debugging an email problem, but in the end its either one
or the other.

Finally, you get an offsite backup of the MailStores as a freebie, in
case something 'bad' where to happen to either the public or office server.

Sincerely,

William Kern
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David Lang
2016-07-08 21:34:01 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, WK wrote:

> On 7/7/2016 7:47 PM, David Lang wrote:
>> I started with Cyrus. How would Dovecot be any better? Does it have
>> back-end replication/clustering/failover like Cyrus does? or some other
>> feature that would let me replicate/split my mail repository?
>>
>> I routinely have high tens of thousands, to low hundreds of thousands of
>> mail in a single folder, cyrus handles that well (even without a SSD), how
>> would Dovecot handle that?
>
>
> Dovecot has their dsync tool (kind of like rsync for Maildirs).
>
> It works extremely well.
>
> We have a several clients at $dayjob who maintain their IMAP servers in
> VMs/HW Servers here and then dsync down to a dovecot/postfix box at their
> office. That way, they always have a local copy for when they are at their
> office. It cuts down on the junk traffic out the gateway when you have a
> limited office internet connection shared by a bunch of employees.
>
> They also rate limit outbound SMTP from the office mailserver's outbound
> queue. The employees can dump email into the queue at line speed, but the
> outgoing SMTP doesn't suck all the BW out of the connection when its a bunch
> of huge files.
>
> Then of course for mobile and their home, they just point their imap client
> at the public VM.

so does this allow for a message to be deleted on the office server and then
have it disappear from the public VM? or is it a one-way sync?

how upt-to-the-minute can this be? (i.e. how long between deleting things in one
place and having them disappear in the other place). Thinking about fail trees
with hundreds of thousands to millions of messages in them.

David Lang
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WK
2016-07-08 21:46:32 UTC
Permalink
On 7/8/2016 2:34 PM, David Lang wrote:
> On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, WK wrote:
>
>> On 7/7/2016 7:47 PM, David Lang wrote:
>>> I started with Cyrus. How would Dovecot be any better? Does it have
>>> back-end replication/clustering/failover like Cyrus does? or some
>>> other feature that would let me replicate/split my mail repository?
>>>
>>> I routinely have high tens of thousands, to low hundreds of
>>> thousands of mail in a single folder, cyrus handles that well (even
>>> without a SSD), how would Dovecot handle that?
>>
>>
>> Dovecot has their dsync tool (kind of like rsync for Maildirs).
>>
>> It works extremely well.
>>
>> We have a several clients at $dayjob who maintain their IMAP servers
>> in VMs/HW Servers here and then dsync down to a dovecot/postfix box
>> at their office. That way, they always have a local copy for when
>> they are at their office. It cuts down on the junk traffic out the
>> gateway when you have a limited office internet connection shared by
>> a bunch of employees.
>>
>> They also rate limit outbound SMTP from the office mailserver's
>> outbound queue. The employees can dump email into the queue at line
>> speed, but the outgoing SMTP doesn't suck all the BW out of the
>> connection when its a bunch of huge files.
>>
>> Then of course for mobile and their home, they just point their imap
>> client at the public VM.
>
> so does this allow for a message to be deleted on the office server
> and then have it disappear from the public VM? or is it a one-way sync?

its two way

http://wiki.dovecot.org/Replication

>
> how upt-to-the-minute can this be? (i.e. how long between deleting
> things in one place and having them disappear in the other place).
> Thinking about fail trees with hundreds of thousands to millions of
> messages in them.
>

I believe there is now a daemon that can track that but I'm pretty sure
we are still using a cronjob that fires off once every 10-30 minutes
depending upon the size/# of users of the server.

You can do it per Maildir and throw a flag to prevent overruns.

As far as performance, I know that some of the clients have extremely
large boxes and it seems to handle that reasonably quickly. We do notice
when there is a huge change, such as someone renaming a folder or moving
files from one large folder to another.
That was one of the reasons we were doing it by Maildir/user and
throwing a flag. If the cronjob came around to the same user and the
process was still going it skipped that one.

So yes, there could be delays, though it seems to track a 'change' file
so its otherwise pretty efficient.

-bill


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